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post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-13-2010, 08:49 PM Thread Starter
 
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Riot Overheat Issue

One of the things I had to do with the Riot I picked up was to replace the starter gear that is inside the motor. This meant I had to remove the entire right hand side of the motor (including the coolant impellar and single coolant line to it).

Now that I have refilled the radiator (it was at least half empty) I don't seem to get any coolant flow. The oil lines to the front get hot, but the coolant lines never get even remotely warm. And eventually I get an engine overheat light (flashing). I don't know if the thermostat worked right before, so I can't rule that out.

But I was wondering, if first, if there is a trick to "priming" the coolant system. I've even tried hoisting the front of the Riot up about 4 feet in the air so that the radiator was for sure higher than the engine. And then idled until the fan kicked on. Still no warmth in the lines. And the radiator is still full.

Thoughts?????? I want to recall some folks having issue with getting the coolant fully primed. But can't remember for sure.

Thanks.
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post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-13-2010, 09:17 PM
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

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Originally Posted by four_by_nut View Post
One of the things I had to do with the Riot I picked up was to replace the starter gear that is inside the motor. This meant I had to remove the entire right hand side of the motor (including the coolant impellar and single coolant line to it).

Now that I have refilled the radiator (it was at least half empty) I don't seem to get any coolant flow. The oil lines to the front get hot, but the coolant lines never get even remotely warm. And eventually I get an engine overheat light (flashing). I don't know if the thermostat worked right before, so I can't rule that out.

But I was wondering, if first, if there is a trick to "priming" the coolant system. I've even tried hoisting the front of the Riot up about 4 feet in the air so that the radiator was for sure higher than the engine. And then idled until the fan kicked on. Still no warmth in the lines. And the radiator is still full.

Thoughts?????? I want to recall some folks having issue with getting the coolant fully primed. But can't remember for sure.

Thanks.

Jay,

Check for an air lock in the return hose that feeds the water pump. Try disconnecting the lower radiator hose at the the piping and rotate it up and fill it. Go back to the hose where it enters the water pump and burp the air there so the water pump primes with anti-freeze. Hook the radiator hose back up and fill. I have found one air locked in this location.

Also in each side of the cylinder head there is a plug (4mm allen). Back the plugs out and let the air purge out of the cylinder head.

Do this and then check to see if you see any flow with the radiator cap off coming into the radiator from the top hose?


Mike

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post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-13-2010, 09:25 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

Cool deal. I'll give that a try in the next few days. I suspect the impeller is just sitting in an air pocket and does not self prime. What you say above makes sense. I will give it a try and let you know how it turns out.
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post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-14-2010, 09:28 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

Took lower hose off at the motor. As I cracked it loose, coolant was pouring out. Quickly snapped it back on.

Took upper hose off at the motor (next to the thermostat). Like the lower, coolant immediately came out. Snapped it back on.

Took hose off from left hand side of motor that goes into the left side of thermostat tube. It was a little low. But not much to matter. But I filled it anyway.

Ran the motor for a while with the rad cap off. Level in the rad would pulse up and down a little. As it warmed, the level slowly rose and kept running out the overflow. Never did the flow go into/out of the radiator. The fan came on and the oil lines were hot. Lines at the radiator were cold/room temp.

I turned the motor off, hooked up my cherry picker to the front of the rig and hoisted the front tires about 4 feet in the air. I was able to pour more coolant down the upper tube. But shouldn't have mattered as that is the "pressure" side to the radiator. It should "self prime" in my opinion.

Fired the motor with the nose in the air. Fan came on right away but radiator lines never got warm. IE: no flow.

Put the rig back on level ground and still a no go.

So...........................I'm going with a stuck thermostat. The rig sat for about a year or a year and a half without having been run. So perhaps it is stuck. I plan to pull the thermostat out tomorrow or Wednesday and see if I can move it by hand. Don't know if I need a new one or just to clean up the current one.

More to come............
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post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-14-2010, 11:15 PM
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by four_by_nut View Post
Took lower hose off at the motor. As I cracked it loose, coolant was pouring out. Quickly snapped it back on.

Took upper hose off at the motor (next to the thermostat). Like the lower, coolant immediately came out. Snapped it back on.

Took hose off from left hand side of motor that goes into the left side of thermostat tube. It was a little low. But not much to matter. But I filled it anyway.

Ran the motor for a while with the rad cap off. Level in the rad would pulse up and down a little. As it warmed, the level slowly rose and kept running out the overflow. Never did the flow go into/out of the radiator. The fan came on and the oil lines were hot. Lines at the radiator were cold/room temp.

I turned the motor off, hooked up my cherry picker to the front of the rig and hoisted the front tires about 4 feet in the air. I was able to pour more coolant down the upper tube. But shouldn't have mattered as that is the "pressure" side to the radiator. It should "self prime" in my opinion.

Fired the motor with the nose in the air. Fan came on right away but radiator lines never got warm. IE: no flow.

Put the rig back on level ground and still a no go.

So...........................I'm going with a stuck thermostat. The rig sat for about a year or a year and a half without having been run. So perhaps it is stuck. I plan to pull the thermostat out tomorrow or Wednesday and see if I can move it by hand. Don't know if I need a new one or just to clean up the current one.

More to come............
Try heating up a coffee cup of water in the microwave or boil some water on the stove and stick the thermostat in it and watch for it to open. Use a thermometer or heat gun to check the water temp to see that it will open at the right temp.

FYI> The snap ring that holds the thermostat in can be a bear. Make sure you get it seated in all the way when you put it back together.

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post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-15-2010, 09:29 AM
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

I always have to remove the bleeder Mike metioned when I service my coolant. Seems an air pocket forms at the top of the cylinder head in the water jackets. I have literally pulled it out with a warm engine and it took ten seconds to get water. Be sure and do both sides!!


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post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-15-2010, 06:46 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

FINALLY got it flowing! I have no idea what I did different than previous. But what I did was...........

1) Pinched tubing just before and after the thermostat line.
2) Removed both lines on either side of thermostat.
3) Pulled thermostat and boiled it in hot water. It was fully open around 190 or so. So........thermostat appears to work......but maybe it was stuck before? Or going to stick again?
4) Put thermostat back in.
5) With tubes slightly pinched, I pourec coolant in the radiator and let it flow into and out of the tubes at the motor. I quickly reconnected the tubes while coolant was flowing out of them.
6) Went back to the front and removed the lower tube at the radiator at it's highest point up front.
7) Once again I filled the radiator until running out of the tubing and while flowing out I reconnected them.
8) Refilled the radiator, fired it up..........and POW! Coolant was flowing.

So.........have no idea what I did this time from last that made it work. But.........it's working. Could have been the thermostat just needing to be cycled. Who knows. But I'm not complaining now.

FIXED!
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post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-15-2010, 07:40 PM
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

Before you get in the boonies, please burp them heads my friend..... Just a CYA move.... It worked for me every time...


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post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-15-2010, 07:56 PM Thread Starter
 
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

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Before you get in the boonies, please burp them heads my friend..... Just a CYA move.... It worked for me every time...
That I will do! But..........I feel like an idiot, but there are 4 set screws in the head. Which two are important? And do I "burp" it while the motor is running? Or sitting still? And will it pour out? Or will it just dribble out?

I figure it's better to understand fully before I start guessing.
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post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 06-16-2010, 04:23 AM
 
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Re: Riot Overheat Issue

I have been told by a couple builders that Webers are known to run a little hot and the distance between the motor and the radiator is a long way for these pumps to push coolant and that removing the thermo is the way to go. I had gotten the temp light blinking every once in awhile before the turbo. I had it pulled out when he did the mod. and no more light. The small impellor has a hard time overcoming the thermo also. I was told the thermo is there mainly for the snowmobile apllication and we really do not need it if we are in warmer weather. I do not ride in the cold, so out it came. I also blead the heads as Ron said and worked well for me. I did not know there was one on each side. I will have to check afterwhile.



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